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NEW YORK AND MONTANA IRON COMPANY. amendment of the Senator from Calfornia, to that it may, perhaps, defeat the grant. I think Mr. WADE. I move now to take up Sen

insert in the thirteenth line of the first section the bill is sufficiently clear without this amendate bill No. 203, the unfinished business of the of the amendment reported by the committee, ment. morning hour of yesterday.

after the word “be,' the words - made under Mr. JOHNSON. I suppose the objection The motion was agreed to; and the Senate, regulations from and.”

of the honorable inember from Ohio is to the as in Committee of the Whole, resumed the

The amendment to the amendment was latter part of the amendment, not to the first consideration of the bill (S. No. 203) to enable agreed to.

part. the New York and Montana Iron Mining and

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The ques- Mr. CONNESS. Will the Senator permit Manufacturing Company to purchase a certain

tion now is on the amendment of the Senator me to explain the amendment? amount of the public lands not now in market;

from California, to strike out in the fourteenth Mr. JOHNSON. Certainly. the pending question being on the amendment line of the amendment of the committee the Mr. CONNESS. The question involved here of Mr. POMEROY to the first section of the words “Secretary of the Interior,

" and to

is whether you will grant twenty miles of land amendment reported as a substitute for the

insert “ Commissioner of the General Land in a mining region which may contain the most bill by the Committee on Public Lands. Office."

valuable mines of gold and silver, or whether Mr: POMEROY. I desire to withdraw the

Mr. CONNESS. If there be any objection you will not. I know there is an exception amendment that I moved yesterday, which was

to that amendment I have no objection to its made in the bill of non-conveyance of lands to add the proviso at the end of the original withdrawal.

containing these precious metals; but it is imbill to the first section of the substitute re- Mr. WADE. I hope the Senator will with. || possible, as this company are authorized to go ported by the committee, and to offer another draw it.

into the forests, into a new country, to deter

That proposition which will better secure the object

The PRESIDENT pro tempore.

mine before they obtain the title to the lands, I have in view. No action having been taken | amendment is withdrawn.

whether valuable mines of the precious metals upon it, I suppose it is competent for me to Mr. CONNESS. I propose to insert at the are contained in these lands or not. They will withdraw it, which I now do, and in lieu of it

end of tlie second section of the amendment therefore get the title and the patent of the I propose to insert in the tenth line of the first of the committee the words “for the period of United States to the lands before those discor. section of the substitute, after the word "pur- thirty days;" so that it will read:

eries can be made. Suppose that by the bill, poses' the words “or in any other preemp

Sec. 2. Andbeit further enacted, That the said com- although the patents issue, such lands are retion or homestead settlement ;'; my object being

pany may acquire immediate possession thereof on served as shall be found to contain valuable

the selection of the said lands by permanently marksimply to make secure any settlement that may ing their boundaries and publishing a description

mines; I apprehend that without a provision, have been made against the location to be thereof in any two newspapers of general circulation as a condition of the title, allowing persons to made by this company.

in the said Territory for the period of thirty days. enter those lands, no person would have the Mr. WADE. If the Senator will allow me, Mr. WADE. There is no objection to that. right to go on them, and the mines would be I will state that the Senator from California The amendment to the amendment was practically reserved to and subject to the will [Mr. Coxness] has shown me an amendment agreed to.

of the company to whom we give title to the that he has prepared which I believe covers Mr. CONNESS. I now propose to amend

land. the whole ground, and to which I have no the fourth section of the amendment of the

The next point is as to the use of such timobjection. committee by striking out all after the word

ber as shall be necessary to work those mines. Mr. POMEROY. Very well; I will with- “coal,'' at the end of the second line, in the

In the first place, you will remember that all draw my amendment and listen to the amend- following words:

the timber on these twenty miles of land goes ment of the Senator from California.

with the land to these parties. It is said they Or to any lands held by right of possession, or by The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The Sena- any other title, except Indian title, valid at the time

want the timber in order to work the iron. So tor from Kansas withdraws his amendment to of ihe selection of the said lands.

they do; but they are not prevented by my the amendment of the committee.

And to insert in lieu thereof:

amendment from having all the timber that Mr. CONNESS. I have prepared a few Nor to any lands lying within any grant for rail

they will require. But if the lands be valuable amendments to this bill with a view of perfect

road purposes heretofore made, nor to any lands held for the purpose for which we are about to make

by possession for mining or agricultural purposes, ing it or making it unobjectionable, and at the nor, should mines of the precious metals be hereafter

this grant, as to give this company the right to same time, of course, carrying out the purposes discovered upon said lands, shall any citizen of the

make this selection and purchase, certainly the that its friends have in view. In the thirteenth United States be prevented from entering thereon lands are also valuable if they shall be found line of the first section of the amendment of

and mining for the same, nor from using, free of to contain valuable mines of the precious met

charge, so much timber as shall be necessary for such the Committee on Public Lands, I propose to mining purposes.

als to the public; but they will be valueless insert after the word “be” the words is made So that the section will read;

unless they are permitted to be worked, and under regulations from and," and in the four- Sec. 4. And be it further enacted, That the said pat

they cannot be worked without timber. teenth line, to strike out the words “Secretary ents shall convey no title to any mineral lands ex

The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The mornof the Interior" and insert " Commissioner of cept iron and coal, nor to any lands lying within any ing hour having expired, it becomes the duty the General Land Office ;'' so that the clause grant for railroad purposes heretofore made, &c.

of the Chair to call up the special order. will read:

Mr. WADE. On reflection I am disposed Mr. CONNESS. Let it lie over informally. Three of which sections may be selected of lands

to think that that is an unnecessary precaution. Mr. WADE. I hope that the special order containing iron orc and coal, and the remaining sec- It will certainly throw a cloud over the title will be passed over informally, so that we may tions of timber lands near the said selections containinz ore and coal, which selections shall be made under

that this company will acquire by purchase be permitted to take a vote on this bill. regulations from, and subject to the approval of, the

from the Government. Of course they will Mr. CONNESS. I shall only occupy a few Commissioner of the General Land Office.

have no right to any gold that may be discov- || moments in explaining this amendment. That is the only amendment I propose to ered on the land by anybody, for under this The PRESIDENT pro tempore. By com; that section. The amendment reconciles it to bill they have no right to take gold and silver mon consent, the special order may be laid the practice of the Land Office.

or anything but iron and coal. But if persons aside if there be no objection. Mr. WADE. I do not think there is any are to be permitted to go searching upon that Mr. HENDRICKS. Let it be laid aside objection to that amendment; but the Senator land and they should find gold somewhere informally, so that it shall be the business in from Indiana (Mr. HENDRICKS) has had great upon it, and are then to be permitted to cut order as soon as this bill is disposed of. experience on this subject, and I should rely | the timber belonging to this company, it would The PRESIDENT pro tempore. No obo more on his judgment than on my own, in render the whole grant very uncertain. I think jection being made, that will be considered regard to this amendment.

when we expressly reserve in the bill all mines as the understanding of the Senate. The lir. HENDRICKS. My only objection is to except those of iron and coal, sufficient cau- Chair hears no objection. the latter part of the amendment, inserting | tion has been had. I think it is anticipating Mr. CONNESS. If you shall subject all “ Commissioner of the General Land Office what will not probably take place, and it will the timber upon this twenty miles of land to instead of the “Secretary of the Interior.". It | throw, as I said before, a cloud over the title the will of the parties to whom you now conhas been the custom to submit the question || that this company will acquire; because, after vey the land, you practically subject the valof important selections of the public lands to they have purchased and taken possession of uable mines that may be discovered there also the Secretary of the Interior. Railroad lands, ll the land, it will reserve not only the mines to their use; for they may put such a price swamp lands, and other selections are submit

upon that land, but will reserve the privilege upon the timber as will make it utterly imted to his judgment as the head of the Depart- to strangers of going on there and using the practicable for anybody but themselves to ment. Of course, before they go to him they timber on the land of this company to work work the mines, and it may be totally impracpass the supervision of the General Land Office, | the mines that may be discovered. I think ticable to obtain timber from the contiguous and the bill as it now stands secures the exam. there is no necessity for that.

territory ; for twenty miles of timber may ination both of the Commissioner and of the And here I desire to say that this bill has embrace all that there may be within a very Secretary. I do not see any propriety in cut- been submitted to the most critical and search: || large district; and thus we come back to the ting off the Secretary's revision of the judgment | ing examination of the Committee on Public original proposition. If the purpose is to of the Commissioner, as is customary on all | Lands, and especially of the gentleman on that make the grant complete, then I have nothing such questions. I do not object to the first committee most competent to make this exam- to say, because the Senate will understand part of the amendment, and therefore shall ask | nation, who himself, perhaps, is as much a when they vote that they vote upon that propfor a separate vote on it.

master of this whole subject as any gentleman osition. If the purpose is really to reserve the The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The ques- in the Union. I think we have submitted to mines, remembering at the same time that the tion will be taken on each amendment pro- about amendments enough. I am afraid this owners of this land and this iron-working composed separately. The question now is on the Il amendment will involve the title, or cloud it so pany will have a right to become miners ther

own coast.

selves, they may enter and discover the mines, bers of it here. I care nothing about whether this country to develop any such interest. The and they may retain possession of those mines, this amendment is adopted or not. I live in persons who discover iron-and this is the age and the condition that is inposed here may the very midst of a country involving the con- of iron-are protected sufficiently by the present ivure to them, so that there is no conflict if ditions that I discuss, and I have seen them law. Those who discover gold or silver or cop: that should occur; but if other citizens are to from day to day, for years of my life. We per, or any other valuable metal, are protected be permitted to enter, to explore and ascer- have appended the same condition to our Pa- sufficiently by the present law. That to a comtain whether valuable mines exist there or cific railroad grants. We granted to the Pacific pany incorporated there should be granted not, I submit that the right to use as much railroad all the timber upon the eren sections | twenty sections, is a proposition the meaning timber as is necessary to carry on their pur- and the land and the timber upon the odd l of which I can only understand in this way, pose is an absolute necessity to their occu- sections; but you will find that we incorpo- || that it is a matter of speculation. The men of pancy. I submit that to any Senator who is rated an amendment, in 1864, in the grant, the West, where I inhabit, have been too much acquainted with that section of the country reserving against the railroad company and disturbed by speculation. Individual enterand its business.

fornrer grant of the timber as much of that I prise has developed all the West, from the Mr. WADL. I shall occupy but a moment timber as was necessary for the operations of Mississippi valley to the mountains and to my of time. I might apply to this case the old the miners upon the even sections where mines

We have not sought the support maxim, "If the sky should fall we may catch may be discovered, because the reservation of of organizations arranged in New York, which larks. Now, sir, this proposition is as broad the timber is as necessary as the right to work is my own native State and of which I speak as it is long. The gentleman thinks that by the mine itself. This amendment, therefore, with respect.

All these things have been probability a gold mine may be discovered is not applying a new condition, but carrying achieved by individual enterprise, as they have there valuable to work, and if it is, he wants out a policy that has been adopted, and a policy | combined themselves; and companies organthe timber that these parties purchase sub- that every man who lives in a mining regiou | ized here for speculative purposes have no right jected to the purpose of working those mines. understands the necessity of.

to any such franchise or any such grant from It may be perhaps as possible in the future Mr. KIRKWOOD. I should like to make this Government. To pass such an act as this that such a mine will be discovered, and that a suggestion to the Senator from California. would be an evil precedent. It should not be they will waut all our timber and thus destroy || I understand very well the propriety of the reg. incorporated in our laws. I speak to the main our iron-works, as it will be that we shall de- ervation in regard to the lands falling within question of the bill and to those who have conprive the gold miner of the opportunity of the line of the Pacific railroad. They need sidered what the office and business of legis. discovering a mine and prevent him from the timber for ties; but in this case this land, lators is. Those who are ignorant should not using the timber to work it. The cases are except where iron ore itself exists, is needed | undertake to speak of countries which they altogether too remote. They escaped the for the purpose of producing coal to work the never inhabited and about which they know searching investigation of that most compe- ore. I understand from the Senator from Cal- | nothing. Those who think should pause. There tent committee that reported this bill, and I || ifornia that the necessity for timber in mines are but few here-I know none but my col. hardly think they would wish to attach to it a is for no other purpose than that of cropping | league and myself in this Senate Chamber and provision to anticipate against a contingency -I do not know the technical name.

the Senators from Nevada—who know anything so remote and so unlikely to occur.


Mr. CONNESS. Timbering their tunnels about the country concerning which it is now the one hand it is as likely to affect us who and shafts.

proposed to legislate. I cannot account for ask this grant and propose to pay for it, as Mr. KIRKWOOD. For timbering their tun- the bill except as a matter of personal specu; it is that the discovery will be made by some- nels and shafts. I apprehend the amendment | lation against the policy of the country and body else, and that they will want the use would not be objectionable if it were confined | against its true interest. of our timber. I think it is too remote alto- to that ; but under this amendment extensive Mr. WILLIAMS. Mr. President, I desire gether, and it is subjecting the grant to such steam-works and all that kind of thing may be to make one or two suggestions as to this bill contingencies as will render it less valuable set up

there and the timber taken off this land with a view of eliciting some information. My and less secure, and make men hesitate to to run those steam-works.

attention has not been called to it until this embark in it, for it must be remembered that Mr. HENDRICKS. If the Senator from morning. I find that section two of the bill in order to go on with this great work of Iowa will yield to me for one moment, I desire provides that this company may acquire immanufacturing iron in this distant Territory to suggest to the Senator from California that mediate possession of this land by marking a great capital must be laid out, there in I cannot conceive that his amendment is neces- the boundaries and publishing a description the start. It will require a very large capi-sary for the purposes that he desires. The bill thereof in any two newspapers of general cir. tal to start the work, and capitalists are very || already declares that no mineral lands other culation in the said Territory. apt to be frightened out of their propricty if than coal or iron shall be granted; and it pro- Now, if I understand the meaning of that they see such unusual conditions attached to vides that the title which shall be issued shall section and of the other provisions of the bill, the grant. They do not like to run the hazard. not convey any lands containing the precious it is that this company can proceed at once, as That is the principal objection that I have to metals. Now, the company by the patent get soon as they mark their boundaries and publish it. The danger is certainly so remote that the no title to any land except of the character their description of these lands, to take possesgentleman cannot suppose that it is necessary intended to be granted. They cannot take i sion of the lands and hold them for two years to anticipate and provide against a contingency more than that. They do not become the own- withont taking any other step, and during that 80 unlikely to occur.

ers, by virtue of the patent, of any lands ex- time they may make any use of these lands they Mr. CONNESS. The danger and the objec- cept of the classes described. The effect of see proper. They may cut off and convert the tion to making such a grant as this in a coun- the amendment proposed is to give the right timber to any use, and in every way appropritry entirely new is, that nobody knows what to take timber on land that is not of the char- ate the lands contrary to the intendment of this that country contains. I submit to the honor- acter described. If you adopt this amend

bill. able Senator from Ohio that this is not by any meut, it makes the title uncertain as far as they Mr. KIRKWOOD. Will the Senator read means a remote condition, because you are to have a right to acquire. Therefore, I think, the last section of the substitute? begin at the beginning of it. Persons enter if we intend to pass this bill, we had better Mr. WILLIAMS. I do not know that that upon that land, knowing nothing of what it stand by the language of the committee. changes particularly the effect of the second contains, or what are in its bowels. I am not Mr. CONNESS. I find a good deal of ob- section. *I desire further to inquire-I think strenuous about the proposition that I have ljection to this amendment. As I said before, it is desirable to know-who constitute this submitted ; but I feel it iny duty to explain it my purpose is not to oppose one tittle of inter New York and Montana Iron Mining and to the Senate, so that they may vote under- ference or impediment against this bill. I am Manufacturing Company. Is this one of the standingly upon it. It is a matter of very quite aware of the practical necessity of the moonshine organizations that are so numerous little consequence to me whether you grant to suggestion that I have made. At the same at the present day, or is it composed of solid, A B twenty miles of land in the midst of one time, having placed my views on the subject substantial men? Do they mean business by of your Territories or not. I have always been before the Senate, I am perfectly willing to securing this grant? I do not know but that of the opinion that the title should go to the withdraw the amendment. It is, as I stated the policy of the bill may be perfectly correct; mines ; and if the purpose here is to convey before, a matter of no consequence to me. but before I vote to grant to any company conthe title to the mines, all right, let it be done. The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The amend. || sisting of persons unknown to Congress twenty Bui I submit that if that is not the purpose, ment is withdrawn.

sections of land, I desire to have more inforand you are going to grant twenty miles of Mr. McDOUGALL. Mr. President, it is my mation on the subject than I have at this time, land for the purpose of working iron, and you opinion that the amendment proposed by the because by this grant we not only transfer this intend to reserve to your people the working Senator, my colleague, would be a well-advised land, which may be very valuable, but it also of the mines of precious metals that may be amendment if the bill required it; but I do not becomes a precedent, as it occurs to my mind, discovered there, you should reserve to them think it exactly germane to the bill. It is my which we may be hereafter called upon to fol. the reasonable use of the mines and of the judgment that the whole proposition is what low, and in that respect it assumes an imporworking of the mines. The one is not worth may be denominated as special legislation. I tance. I do not know that after I am further anything without the other. My purpose is do not understand why the New York and advised upon the subject I shall oppose this pot to embarrass this company, nor to throw a Montana Iron Mining and Manufacturing Com- bill, but I should like to have more information cloud ujion their property.

panys' should be authorized within one year than I now have about the matter. But the honorable Senator replies to me after the approval of this act" to select tracts Mr. WADE. I know some of these corpotwice, thrice, that a committee have examined of land in the Territory of Montana “which, || rators, and they are some of the wealthiest men the bill. So they have. I submit the remarks in the aggregate, shall not exceed twenty sec- I know of; they have been engaged long in the I have made to that committee, or to the mein- tions." Such a thing has never been done in iron business. Mr. Ward, of Detroit, is one,

He was


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who is very extensively engaged and has been tion being on the motion of Mr. HENDERSON I will refer only to two cases.

I read from for many years in that business. to postpone the further consideration of the

page 38 of the report of the board, in regard applied to to join this enterprise. It was sup- bill until the first Monday in December next. to the Mattabesett and the Shamrock: posed that it would be a great benefit to that Mr. SHERJAN. I desire to give notice * The contract price was $161,000." western country, to the Pacific railroad, to the that if I can get the consent of a majority of "There is no charge in the bill (annexed to this record working of the mines, and everything else the Senate on Monday, whatever else may in

and marked No.39) for any condemned material or

faulty workmanship, and it shows the actual cost of there, it'instead of taking all their iron from the terpose, I shall seek to press the passage of the labor and material, and the bill of extra work shows East and carrying it thousands of miles over Post Office appropriation bill, and on the next a profit of about twenty per cent. At the time of the plains without any roads or proper means day the Army appropriation bill. The accu

taking these contracts there were no drawings fur

nished, and it was understood that the engines were of carriage, manufactories could be erected upon mulation of business from the Committee on

to be about the same size and weight of the class of the spot where iron to a large amount might Finance is becoming so great that we feel it the Paul Jones, but in reality were of very much be made. It would be a great benefit to the our duty to press these appropriation bills on

heavier weight and increased size, which was one of

the chief causes of loss to the contractors, over and country, and those engaged in it believe that Monday and Tuesday next; and I give this above the contract price." they could make it profitable to themselves. notice now, so that Senators may make their We are all confident that such an enterprise,

Now, I call the attention of the Senate to arrangements accordingly, that I shall expect if successful, will be of the greatest benefit to the Post Office and the Army appropriation

the case of the machinery for the Pawtuxet, on

page 21. There the report says: the people of the country there, enabling them bills to be disposed of on Monday and Tuesday. to crect machinery to work their gold mines, Mr. HENDRICKS. I wish the attention of “The excess of cost, over and above the contract and use iron for all the purposes for which iron the Senate for a few moments to one or two

price, was due to the groater weight of engine than

the contractors were led to expect them to be, Mr. in a country like that is useful. It is more points made against this bill by the Senator Isherwood, chief of the Bureau of Steam Engiucering doubtful in my mind whether it will prove to from New Hampshire [Mr. CLARK] some days

having assured them that they woulil pot exceed

those of the Paul Jones class, (three hundred and be a good speculation. since. It will be recollected by the Senate that

seventy-four thousand pounds;) whereas the weight Betore such men as Ward and some other the Senator from New Hampshire objected to of one huilt by them was six hundred and thirty wealthy men that are engaged in business—who the bill upon the ground that it provided relief

thousand pounds." are not speculators any more than they can for some persons whose title to relief he Very much above what was supposed by the speculate out of a legitimate business-would doubted. Among others, he selected the con- contractors at the time the contracts were made. embark in such an enterprise, it was deemed tractor for the machinery of the double-enders | The trouble was, that at the time the contracts necessary that the company should have a grant Chenango and Ascutney, Mr. Quintard. Now were entered into, or the bids received, the of lands something like this, and for this reason, I wish to call the attention of the Senate to the drawings and specifications were not prepared. which will occur to the Senator from Oregon very points in the report to which the Senator I presume these men were sufficiently intelliin a moment: if they should lay out $200,000 from New Hampshire alluded in his argument. gent in their business to know what would be or $300,000 and commence operations there After showing the excess of the cost over and the weight and expense of an engine in ordiin erecting their furnaces and other works, the above the contract price, the report of the nary tiines if the drawings and specifications people about there would see at once, "These | board goes on to say:

were complete; but twelve of these contractors men who are preparing to operate thus exten- “That there is no charge in the bill for these vessels establish in their cases that the machinery was sively will want the timber near by,'' and they for rebracing the boilers; that the causes of delay in much heavier than was supposed at the time would enter upon the lands immediately and

building the hull and inachinery of the Onondaga
were on account of expensive alterations, and also

the contracts were made or the bids put in. have it in their power to put the furnace com- the same as apply to the Chenango and Ascutney; Although the argument of the Senator from pany upon just such terms in regard to timber that he was relieved from the time of his contract for New Hampshire was forcible against this parfor making coal as they saw fit. These men

this vessel, so far as regards time of completion, by
the extensive alterationsordered to be maile, and that

ticular class, and was very favorable to another said at once, “Although it may be a good the Department was fully satisfied that she was lin

class, I think this entire class of contractors business for us, provided we can get the means ished as soon as possible."

for the machinery are also entitled to relief. of working it, we will not undertake it unless we This entire contract for building the machin- I ask the attention of that Senator to the fact can secure the title to enough timber land to ery of these vessels, the Chenango and Ascut- that the average of loss to the men who conmake coal suflicient to carry on this business.ney and for the hull and machinery of the tracted for the machinery was above $25,000, Is that unreasonable? I know very well that | Onondaga was taken together, as I understand; some $29,000, and some $10,000, but the they will not enter on this business unless they and the report of the board covers in this pas- average was about $25,000. Now the propocan thus acquire a title. They would be very sage the entire three pieces of work. The loss sition of the Senator from Jowa brings down foolish to do so, because the prosperity of their of Messrs. Quintard & Company was $29,000, the allowance of each one of these to less business would immediately be in the hands of shown by tlie eridence, upon good work, the than $10,000. strangers that would impose upon them just quality of the work not questioned anywhere. The contract price for machinery was $82,000. such terms as they pleased in regard to an The board finds that their loss upon this par The Senator from Iowa has secured an amendessential element without which they cannot ticular machinery was $29,000. The amend- ment that there shall be but twelve per cent. make their capital available. All there is in ment proposed by the Senator from Iowa will allowed upon it, which will be less then $10,000, this bill is that it allows the entry of the land reduce the allowance to a little less than ten if my calculation be correct. We are to allow before the surveys. They may go now if they thousand dollars. So where there was an actual less than $10,000, where the losses average can find iron anywhere on lands open to entry, loss, as proven before the board--and it is not above $25,000. Ofthat entire class there are two and they may enter all the land they please, questioned anywhere-of $29,000, the bill, as where the loss was only between fiveand sixthonprovided they can pay for it. They could do | amended on the motion of the Senator from sand dollars on each vessel; but in those cases so in Montana but for the fact that the land | Iowa, proposes to allow a little less than ten the parties had the iron at the time, and therefore there has not yet been surveyed. They cannot thousand dollars.

there was no loss upon the material, but all the enter it for that reason, and it may not be sur- Mr. President, the machinery for the Che- others averaged, I believe, about twenty-five veyed for two or three or four years. By this nango and for the Ascutney belonged to a class thousand dollars loss. When the fact is shown bill they wish barely to acquire just such a right of twenty-two which will be found in the award in twelve of these cases that the machinery was as everybody will have as soon as the land is made by the board; and I wish to call the very much heavier than the contractors were surveyed. That is all there is about it. attention of the Senate to the fact that the led to suppose at the time, when the further

I hope this explanation will be satisfactory. machinery there contracted for by these men fact is considered that the drawings and speciThere is no other speculation in it than the was of a very much heavier and more expensive | lications were not prepared, and could not be contingency of that business that they propose character than was supposed at the time the with the greatest diligence, I presume, in the

in being profitable. They can work work was commenced. It will be recollected Department, so that the parties might know the no gold mines, they can acquire no title to any by the Senate that there was great demand precise weight and size of the machinery, I subgold or silver mines, nor anything else but for this work at the time. The Government mit whether this little allowance of one third iron; and if there should be coal there they was in a strait for a Navy, and it was impos- of the actual loss is an unreasonable thing for would have the advantage of it. It is not very sible at the time the contracts were made to these parties, the contractors for the machinery, likely they will find any.

have the drawings and specifications prepared to expect at the hands of the Government. Mr. GRIMES. I wish I could look at this so that the contractors might know exactly It may be, Mr. President, that I am all wrong matter

what they were to build. I will call the atten- in my views about this; but this fact has had Mr. HENDRICKS. I ask the Senator from tion of the Senate to the evidence in one or much weight upon my mind: the Government Iuwa to yield that I may call up the other bill. two cases merely as illustrative of the class. was in a strait; she came into this war with I suppose the Senator from Ohio will not now That there was much more expensive machin- a navy that could not contend with any of the object. It appears that this is leading to ery-engines and boilers weighing very much considerable nations of the carth; she had to debate.

more than was supposed at the time it was establish a blockade upon one of the longest The PRESIDENT pro tempore. The special made-is established by the testimony of twelve coasts in the world, at more points than perorder was laid aside only informally by unan

of these establishments. The contractors for haps were ever blockaded in the world; the imous consent. It is now before the Senate. the Mattabesett, the Shamrock, the Chicopee, || Navy Department had to strain every energy

the Tallapoosa, the Otsego, the Metacomet, | possible, it had to require all these workmen CONTRACTORS FOR VESSELS AND MACIIINERY.

the Mendota, the Lenapee, the Mackinaw, the to do its work, and when they preferred doing The Senate resumed the consideration of | Osccola, the Sassacus, and the Pawtuxet, twelve work for individuals rather than going into the bill (S. No. 220) for the relief of certain in all, establish the fact that this machinery was contracts with the Government they were almost contractors for the construction of vessels-of- much heavier and more expensive than was compelled by public sentiment at the demand war and steam machinery, the pending ques. Il supposed at the time the contracts were made. of the Department to undertake it. They did

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undertake it, and at an early day, considering toosuc. If Senators will turn to page 8 of erect it on board, which time expired in the case of the magnitude of the work, they placed upon the report of the commission, composed of

the Agawam on June 10, 1863, but that she was not

by the delivered to the Government until Decemthe ocean a navy that enabled us to defy the. Selfriilge, Fletcher, and Eldredge, they will ber 9, 1863, two hundred and thirty-two days." Powers of the world, the grandest navy in the find the statement of the person who built world, that makes every port along our coast the hulls:

Here is the point: here was this Governsecure against every hostile Power who may “Regarding the contracts for the United States

ment engaged in blockading a coast many times come against it. Is it becoming the dignity steamers Pontoosue and Agawam: there appeared

larger than ever had been attempted before; and the justice of this nation that these men

before the board George W. Lawrence, ship-builder, they wanted the vessels, they contracted for

of Warren, Maine, and constructer and contractor shall bear a loss in the prosecution of so great for the above vessels built by him, at Portland,

the vessels, they stipulated to have them at a a work for the country? For the commanding Maine, and having been duly sworn, stated that

given time; but these people did not deliver general that gains a battle we pass a vote of

the above vessels were constructed at the same time them for more than a year afterward, some six

by him, and the cost elown is that of both together. tbanks and give a medal; and for illustrious

months, some nine months, some twelve months That both contracts were signed on September 9, and great deeds in the history of nations mon- 1802, and the vessels to be launched in one hundred

after they had agreed to deliver them; and all minents are erected; but for these men that

and twenty-six days, or on January 13, 1863. That that time prices were rising; and now they

the Agawam was launched on April 21, 1863, and placed upon the ocean a navy that makes our

come in here and ask us to pay, not for the vesthe Pontoosue on the following May 20, 1863, and on coast as secure as it is possible for man to make those same days, respectively, delivered over to the

sels at the contract price after that time, but a coast-for this great work these men, instead

engine-builders; that the delay in launching wins, on to pay for all the extras they were put to by

his part, of no loss or inconvenience to the Governof having a medal, or a vote of thanks, or a

reason of their delay. After so long a time ment, having been delayed on account of certain monument, are to bear a loss, and some of valves, &c., required previous to launching, having

elapsed beyond the time at which the vessels not been fitted in place by the Portland Works, conthem to go into bankruptcy.

were to be completed, if the Government had tractors for the steam machinery.” Now, sir, I cannot appreciate the sentiment

said, “We will not take these vessels; we wanted

These vessels were detained on the ways that requires that these men should bear all

them for blockading the coast; but you did not this loss. The fact of loss is clearly established.

some two or three months by the want of the furnish them in time; the war is well-nigh Upon that question no member of the commit

valves by the persons who were to furnish the toward its end; we will not take them,” could tee had a doubt, no member of the board who steam machinery.

these contractors have complained? But the examined this question for five minutes had a

6. That the contract piece for each vessel was Government did not say that. The Governdoubt that they sustained the loss, and that they

$75,000," or $150,000 for the two. Here I ment said, “We will take the vessels; we will sustained the loss in many cases because of the

want to call attention to what was the contract pay you the price which we stipulated, even at interference of the Government; and I submit price, or what was the cost of the machinery this late day;' and yet these contractors are

of the Paul Jones. Can the Senator from wliether it is becoming in us to let that loss fall

not content. They want the Government not Indiana tell me? altogether upon them. Taking the classes that

only to pay them the price which it agreed to

Mr. HENDRICKS. No, sir; I cannot. are objected to by the Senator from New Hamp

pay, nine months or a year after the time had shire, they get but about one third of their loss

Mr. CLARK. Can the Senator from Nerada elapsed, when it had been denied the use of by the bill as it is now amended, and taking | machinery of the Paul Jones?

tell me what was the contract price for the the vessels, but also to pay the extra price the entire class they get not quite, I believe, fifiy

which arose by the enhancement of labor and

Mr. NYE. I cannot tell now, but I can materials while they were thus delaying. per cent. of the entire loss; and I submit, if

find out. it is the pleasure of the Senate to relieve these

And in the case of the Pontoosuc, instead of tho parties, if we can do it more securely to the

Nr. CLARK. Perhaps I can inform the Sen- machinery being completed on July 9, 1803, when the Government than by passing the bill as now

ator. I do not know precisely, but my informa- fifty days expired":amended. It allows but twelve per cent. in

tion is—and my information comes from the Two years nearly before the war closed

chairman of the Committee on Naval Affairsany case upon the contract price. My judg

"she was delayed until May 16, 1864, or throe hunthat it was $52,000, or not to exceed $55,000. dred and sixty-one duys." ment is satisfied that this is below what is right.

I understand that to be correct. Mr. CLARK. I gave this matter some

That was within less than a year of the time

Mr. GRIMES. Yes, sir. examination when it was before the Senate at

of the surrender of Lee. She was detained an earlier day. I have given it some exam.

Mr. HENDRICKS. I ask the Senator when

for the want of the machinery three hundred the Paul Jones's machinery was built. ination since; I have given ita more thorough

and sixty-one days, only four days less than a examination since that time than I gave it

Mr. CLARK. I cannot state precisely when

year, enhancing the price of the hull

, which we before; and all the examination and all the it was built.

are obliged to pay, depriving the Government attention that I have been able to bestow upon

some time before the contract was made for it assure. me that the bill ought not to pass.

us to pay this enhanced price. Does the SenIf the Senator from Indiana and those other

these other vessels. The engines of these other ator from Indiana think that qnite right? I

vessels, for which $82,000 was contracted to be gentlemen of the Senate who have this bill in

will ask him, then, to turn with me over to charge liad turned their attention to examining paid, were considerably heavier than that of

pages 16 and 17, and let us see about the mathe Paul Jones. the cases individually, and would show us which

chinery for the Pontoosue and the Agawam. ought to be provided for, and which ought not,

Mr. CLARK. That was precisely the point

" Appeared before the board Edward H. Davis, to which I desired to bring attention. These I could agree to vote for those that ought to

treasurer of the Portland Company, Portland, Maine, men complain that they supposed the engines on the part of the company, contractors for the mapass, and cheerfully vote for them; but when they were to build were to be about the weight

chinery of the double-enders Pontoosuc and Agathey bring here forty-two cases and do not

Under oath states, that the contract for these of the engine of the Paul Jones, and that they pretend that all ought to pass, but that some

vessels was dated, by the Navy Department, August cost more because they were heavier. Now, 30, 1862'are good and some bad, and thus make the good carry the bad, I cannot quite agree to the

the fact is that the machinery of the Paul Jones A little more than a year after the war comwhole. cost $52,000, or not exceeding $55,000, and the

menced Mr. HENDRICKS. The Senator does not Government gave from $75,000 to $80,000,

"in which they were allowed one and a half month quite place the committee right. The commit

$90,000, and over $100,000 for these engines from April 21, 1863, the time of receiving the hull of tee who make this report think that each case for the reason that they were heavier.

the Agawam from the builders, to completo the ma

chincry of said vessel, and one and a half month

Mr. GRIMES. Eighty-two thousand dollars. ought to be relieved. That was the opinion

from May 20, 1863, the time of receiving the hull of

Mr. CLARK. Eighty-two thousand dollars the Pontoosuc from the builders, to complete tho of the committee, but the equities of some

for some, and some higher than that, I think. machinery of said vessels and deliver thom to the were not quite so strong as others.

Mr. GRIMES. Mr. CLARK. Then I will understand the

Eighty-two thousand dol

Government; but the Agawam was not so coinpleted

and delivered until November 30, 1863; the Ponioosuc lars for those that were made on the model of Senator as representing the committee, and the

until April 14, 1861.". the Paul Jones. committee as being of the opinion which he

Mr. CLARK. The same model. Now, it

Now, I ask the Senator's attention particu. now states, that they all ought in eqnity to be

larly to this part of the report, if he will give relieved. Will the Senator allow me to ask is evident at once to the Senate that they had

it to me, to what these people say themselves him if he is of that same opinion still, that they || be allowed to come here and complain that the their consideration for it, and they are not to

in regard to it: all ought to be relieved ? Mr. HENDRICKS. Yes, sir, I am. engines were heavier than that of the Paul "The principal cause of delay was from the diffi

culty of the work, and being unprepared for tho Mr. CLARK. Than I will ask the Senator

Jones, when their price was proportionably manufacture of marine engines, the works having to follow me as I examine some of these cases,

heavier. But I want to go along with these been employed, previous to making this contract, in hulls.

the building of locomotives principally; labor was one by one; and I will ask him by and by,

obtained with difficulty, and when obtained, of an when I come to some of these cases, whether

"That the contract price for each vessel was $75,000 inferior kind."

each, $150,000. The total cost of both vessels, includhe is then of the opinion still. I ask the Sen- ing all extra vork, $180, 429 40. That there was paid Here is this very remarkable statement-I ator to turn his attention first to the cases of the by the Government for extra work $10,319 93; allow- invite the attention of the Senate to it-that

ance made for material sold after completion of resAgawam and the Pontoosuc. I examined, I

these men undertook work which they were not gel, $1,587 93; allowance made for material on hand think, three cases when I spoke to the Senate after completion of vessel. $1,300; making a total for prepared for, which they were not skilled in, before-the cases of the Iosco, the Massasoit, extras of $13,207 86. That the total cost of both ves- which they found to be difficult, and for which

eels over and above the contract stipulations and and the Chenango. I have been through the amounts paid by the bureau for extra work was

their shop was not prepared, and they were list on page 2 of the table of “double-end$17,221 51.

thus delayed two hundred and seventy and three erz, wooden hulls,"! I think, including eleven Precisely that sum is reported here ; for each

hundred and sixty days in the two cases by or twelve, and I find them all much in the same vessel $8,610 77 allowed by the board.

their own inability and want of preparation for condition. I now take the two which come

the work which they undertook; and yet they

“The contractors for the steam machinery were next to the Iosco, the Agawam and the Pon- allowed fifty days after the launching, in order to

come forward and ask you to pay them $40,000


apiece on each vessel. That is the report on engine, what would an individual have said? | Very nearly the same time, it will be seen, was each of these vessels which were delayed thus He would have recovered damages, and he allowed for building all these vessels. by their own insufficiency in preparation for

"That tho contract for the hull of the Osccola was the work. If a man who is unskilled in work would have recovered damages such as he could dated October 15, 1862, and the vessel to be launched undertakes to do it, and binds himself to do it, have shown in any court. But the Govern

on February 3, 1803, (one hundred and twenty-six

days.) That the vessel was remnly for launching April who is to suffer for it? That way exactly this ment did not say that; the Government did 15, 1862. but was not launched until May 23, being case; and now I want to ask the Senator from not say to these men, “We must have damages detained on the ways-the bed-plates not being coin Indiana whether he thinks that men who had from you for not fulfilling this contract;' the

pleted and put in the vessel by the engine-builders," not the ability to do the work, and who found Government went forward liberally, at the end

Here is the same excuse, the same dilliculty it dillicult, whose shop was not fit for it—they | of the time, took the engines, and paid the men -the engines were behind, the bed-plates were had not been used to building marine engines, the money. Now they are not satisfied. They not put in. they had been used to building locoinotives--1 come in here and say, “ We must have more;

That the vessel was delivered to the contractors want to ask him whether, when such men un

for steam machinery on May 23; that they were it is very true we delayed you; it is very true

allowed fifty days, or until July 12, to crcct on board dertake work of that kind, for which they are in the case of the Agawam we were two hun- the engine, &c., but occupied until November 27, not fitted and for which they are not prepared, i dred and twenty-three days behind; it is very

1863.' the Government ought to pay all the extra true in the other case of the Pontoosuc that Here was a delay of one hundred and thirtyexpense they are put to by such unskillfulness we were three hundred and sixty-one days eight days beyond the stipulated time. They and want of preparation? They do not say a behind; but the Government ought to be gen- were to have lifty days, and they took one hunword about the engines being heavier, that ! erous. I agree the Government should be dred and eighty-eight; nearly four times as remember, and yet they may.

I will look and liberal; but when men come into the Congress many. These contractors say: see; they go on state:

of the United States and ask the Go rnment * By the delay on the part of the engine-builders "That the machinery for both vessels cost $992.606 79; to be generous, they should show that they per

to complete the machinery, they (Curtis & Tilden) that the bills for extra work still unpaid are$1,219 37

were unable to complete thio work on tbe two vesels formed good service for the Government. The and receive the several payments as agreed upon in -total cost, $23,926 16; that the contract price was, for both vessels, $161,000; leaving a balance, theexcess

bill is now in a better situation than it was their contracts, and also suffered pecuniary loss from of cost to them over and above the contract price, some days ago; but if we give these men what the great rise in labor and material during that

time. including amountclaimed for extra bills, of $59,82616. this bill provides, twelve per cent., we shall Resulting, as they say, from the difficult pay them over nineteen thousand dollars for

That is, during the time they were delayed.

Mr. NYE. Let me ask the Senator from character of the work, from their not being delaying work in that way, for delaying work prepared for it in their shops, because they by their own unskillfulness, for delaying work

New Hampshire one question, whether it was had not been used to building marine engines, which they could not accomplish for the want

not a fact that the engines and the hulls were but to building locomotives, and because they of proper experience, for delaying work for

separate contracts. The engines constituted

one contract and the hulls another. could not get labor and materials. That is the want of proper shops and tools; and they knew

Mr. CLARK. Certainly. statement they make themselves; and what is when they undertook that work just what their

Mr. NYE. Then the man who built the hull worse than all this, when they ask you to pay shops and tools were fitted for, and they knew $59,826 16 extra, they go on to say: that their experience had been in locomotives

was not to blame. “That there is no chargo in this bill for proportion and not in marine engines.

Mr. CLARK. The man who built the hull, of general expenses in running the works, which is Now, Mr. President, if it could be shown on

if he performed his contract in time, would estimated to be twelvo and a half on the wholo the part of these contractors that they under

not be to blame; and I do not know that in amount, which is a minimum charge, amounting in all to $26,712 81, which thcy claim as a part of the took this work unwillingly, that the Govern

this case the firm of Curtis & Tilden, though actual cost of the vessels' machinery." ment came to them and besonght them to take

they did not get their vessel off until two months They sustained a loss on the contracts of up this work, that they objected to it, that they

after, were to blame, because they were delayed $59,826 16 on the two engines, and then they stated to the Government they were not used

by the men who were to build the machinery wanted $26,712 81 as interest on their tools, to doing it, that their tools were not prepared

and put it in; they were delayed for the want which they say were not fitted for such work, for it, that their shop was not fitted for it, that

of bed-plates. But the machine-builders un

dertook to contract with the Government that and which delayed the work; and this board | they had doubts whether they could carry it actually allowed them $21,041 36 for interest | through in the time stated, and that the Gov

the machinery should be ready. This firm

made a contract that the hull should be done on these tools which were not fit for the work, ernment then urged them, and said, “We must and swelled the whole amount of allowance up have this work from some quarter; we will run

at a certain time, and the engines were to be to over eighty thousand dollars. This board the risk, and you must undertake it and do the

put in in so many days after. The hulls were report for these two vessels completed in that best you can,

" that would have been one

delayed by the engine-builders in not putting way about ninety-seven thousand dollars extra. | thing; but there is not a particle of proof of

in what should have been put in earlier, and They report on each of the hulls- $8,610 77, || anything of that kind. They do not suggest it.

were then delayed by these same machine. and on each of the engines $40,483 73 to these These men were anxious to get these contracts;

builders for a great length of time, four months men who undertook work which they could many of them were exceedingly anxious to get

after the time allowed. The Senator says the not perform, for which they were not pre- them, some not so much so.

man who built the hull was not to blame; but pared, and which they delayed the Govern- sons to whom the Senator has alluded took the

who was? The man who built the machinery; ment in getting, one of them within four days contracts the weight of the engines was speci.

and yet you put the man who built the bull of a whole year, when the Government wanted fied and they knew what they had got to do. It

and the man who built the machinery together, the work. is true they undertook before that to build

and serve them both exactly alike. That is the Now, I want to ask the Senator a question. them, and had gone on before they got the con

effect of your bill. Somebody is to blame. The He says that when a general fights a battle and tracts to commence their work; but they had

Government were defrauded of this rossel--I wins a victory, we vote him thanks. Do we signed no contract, and if when the contract

said defrauded, I mean deprived of the use of vote thanks to that commander who is ten came and the specifications came, they found

this vessel-about two hundred days by somemiles behind and does not get up into line? the work heavier than they expected or agreed

body. By whom? By one or the other; and Most of these men were a year behind and did to do, it was easy to say, “Mr. Secretary of

yet you propose to pay both. Now, if the man not begin to form in line at the time they said the Navy, that is not what I undertook ; you

who built the hull was not to blame, pay him they would, deprived the Government of the represented to me that these engines were to

alone, but do not undertake to pay the man use of the vessels all the time they were so be of the weight of those of the Paul Jones;

who deprived him of the power of putting his hanging back. The price was going up and cannot agree to do that," the objection would

work in the water and delivering it at the time enhancing, and they ask the Government to have been considered ; but that is not this case

he agreed to do--the man who built the mapay that enhanced price which arose from their nor either of these cases which I am consider

chinery. Now, will the Senator from Nevada

and the Senator from Indiana turn to page 17 own delay. That is the statement of the case. ing, for neither of these men allege that he I ask the Senator from Indiana if he is in favor | did not understand what the weight of the

and let us see about this machinery ? of paying the two men who built these two engines was, nor does cither of them allege Appeared before the board Oliver Edwards, engines. Did not the Government do all for that it was heavier than he expected when he

president of the Atlantic Works, East Boston, on tho

part of the company, contractors for this machinery them that the Government ought to do when undertook the contract.

of the double-enders Sassacus and Osceola. Under they took these engines off their hands, nearly I come now to the case of the Osceola, which oath states, that the contract for the Osccola vas

dated September 20, 1862, and for the Sassacus, Octoa year afterward, and paid them the full price is found on pages 6 and 7 of the report of the ber 15, 1862, in which they were allowed seven months, under the contract? If the Government had board:

or until April, 1863, and May, 1863, to complete the said to these men, “You have been delaying 'Appeared before the board E. F. Tilden, of the

machinery of said vessels and deliver them to tho this work; we have suffered for the want of firm of Curtis & Tilden, ship-builders and construet

Government, but the Sassacus was not so completed ers of the United States stcamers Massasoit and and delivered until September, 1863, and the Osccola these engines; you agreed to furnish them at Osceola. Under oath states the whole amount of

until November, 1863." a certain time, but you did not furnish them; cost of above vessels to have been $65,597 35; the And here the whole summer of 1863 passed we must deduct so much from your pay;'' what

amount of extra work allowed and paid by bureau
$7,340 57; the amount of contracts $50,000; the cost

away, when these vessels should have been could these men have said? What would an

of these vessels over and above the contract price operating in the southern Atlantic in the blockindividual have said in a case of that kind? and allowance paid for extra work to be $8,256 78. ade, or elsewhere; the most favorable part of Suppose one individual had contracted with

That the contract for the hull of the Massasoit another to furnish him a marine engine on a was dated September 10, 1562, and the vessel to be

the year passed away, and the vessels were launched on January 14, 1863, (one hundred and still delayed at the wharf for the want of given day, and he did not furnish it until a twenty-six days.)"

machinery; and yet this is not a liberal Gov. year after, and that man had been losing all I shall skip the Massasoit, as I believe I ernment that will come forward and pay the bis trade and business by the want of that li made some observations on that the other day. men what it agreed to pay after such a delay.

When the per

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